Spacing in eight frame Langstroth hives (metric)

For all things bees and beekeeping!
Post Reply
RBK
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:38 pm

Spacing in eight frame Langstroth hives (metric)

Post by RBK » Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:38 pm

A theory for the frame spacing in 8 frame hive boxes:
http://forum.canberrabees.com/t/spacing ... -metric/19

laurie
Posts: 37
Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2015 1:35 am
Location: Theodore ACT

Re: Spacing in eight frame Langstroth hives (metric)

Post by laurie » Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:07 am

mutter.. I might have joined your forum but requiring a minimum of 10 characters for a password on a social forum exceeds my tolerance limit.

I'd hazard a guess that the reason they didn't stretch the 10 frame supers as much as they did the 8 frame might have been because they were limited by truck/dray/ute/trailer width limits.


btw: is "The standard internal width of a 10 frame hive in Australia" really 370mm?
The imperial internal width was 14 1/4" which is approximately 362mm and I thought that was the size in common usage.
I bought a 10-frame wooden super from lockwoods at the field day last weekend specifically because I wanted one to check measurements/fit etc (I don't use 10-frame wooden equipment myself) and it has internal width of 362mm.
I've been working on the understanding that the standard/common internal super widths here in Australia are:
* 10-frame 362mm (and hence has 12mm spare with 10x35mm frames or 32mm with 33mm frames)
* 8-frame 308mm (and hence has 28mm spare with 8x35mm frames or 44mm with 33mm frames so can fit 9)

According to cushmans website http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/lang.html 370mm looks to the metric 10-frame langstroth measurement used in the Britian (and possibly parts of Europe also as my HoneyPaw 10-frame polystyrene hives from Finland have 370mm internal width)

Something I've had recent cause to notice is the variations in bee space above and below frames.
eg timber supers tend to put most of the space above the frame whereas paradise poly hives put most of it below the frame.
So.. if you sandwich a paradise poly hive between two timber ones you end up with 5mm (tempting them to glue it up) under the frames in the poly box and 13mm above (tempting them to fill it with burr comb).
It gets even worse if you mix different poly hives.
frame-upper-lower-beespace.png
(23.08 KiB) Not downloaded yet

RBK
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:38 pm

Re: Spacing in eight frame Langstroth hives (metric)

Post by RBK » Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:07 am

Hi Laurie,

Really appreciate your response and especially the amount of information compressed into it. Apologies about the password requirement, this is a default configuration for security and I regret that it caused you to avoid the site as your information would be great in the context of the conversation.

I will have to look back over my 10 frame equipment as I have always worked off the 14 3/4 sizing for 10 frame box which is 370mm, and matches my experience. I have a great respect for Dave Cushman's research so will take a closer look at this less than standard 'standard'. This doesn't however resolve the additional space in the 8 frame super.

I see you are quoting 33mm frame sizes, are you running 33mm Hoffmans? If so, can you let me know where you are sourcing them from? I know Alliance produce them but buying them in smaller quantity in Australia has been more of a challenge.

The spacing at top and bottom of boxes is another topic I am piecing together a post for, so I really appreciate the information you have posted.

Thanks again for your post, based on your feedback I will update the original post re: 370mm sizing being 'standard' as it may not be as black and white as I'd stated.

laurie
Posts: 37
Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2015 1:35 am
Location: Theodore ACT

Re: Spacing in eight frame Langstroth hives (metric)

Post by laurie » Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:27 pm

Hi
No.. I'm not running 33mm frames but bought a box of plastic frames on ebay a while back that turned out to be 33mm and it appears anecdotally that the current batch of beetek plastic frames being sold by nuplas might be 33mm.
People are reporting they can fit 9 in an 8-frame box.

33mm is the standard in nz (where beetek and ceracell frames are made) which makes sense if you factor in .
- they primarily use 10 frame boxes
- which have less spare space as noted in your starting post

RBK
Posts: 39
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:38 pm

Re: Spacing in eight frame Langstroth hives (metric)

Post by RBK » Mon Mar 06, 2017 7:00 pm

Laurie,

I have taken your feedback on board and made the password requirement more realistic.

I have also updated the original link I posted with your feedback/details referencing your post here. I would have dropped this in a private message.. but apparently you can't do that here!

I also went back over the imperial conversions this afternoon and 370mm is closer to 14 1/2 than 14 3/4 as I have posted above. I was using the following as a reference http://www.beesource.com/wordpress/wp-c ... frlang.pdf (inside dimensions, second diagram from the bottom)

Currently trying to hunt down an early (~1890) reference for 10 frame hive internal dimensions.

Cheers :)

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest